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    Cryptocurrency Daily General Discussion - November 24, 2017

    November 24, 2017

    Cryptocurrency Daily General Discussion - November 24, 2017

    Daily General Discussion - November 24, 2017

    Posted: 23 Nov 2017 10:05 PM PST

    Welcome to the Daily General Discussion thread!

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    What are you thankful for /r/Cryptocurrency?

    Posted: 23 Nov 2017 01:27 PM PST

    After investing small amounts for years and having it always paying off...

    Posted: 23 Nov 2017 03:19 PM PST

    Let's talk about Operation Dragonslayer

    Posted: 23 Nov 2017 05:36 PM PST

    There's a conspiracy theory going around about Bitcoin (BTC) and Bitcoin Cash (BCH/BCC) that I think my fellow redditors should know about.

    TLDR: In 17.5 hours BCH will try to usurp BTC as the "true" Bitcoin and this will cause BTC prices to tank to unrecoverable levels and will have side effects on alts as well since BTC is the main pair.

    Technical TLDR: The conspiracy plan is that when Bitcoin locks their difficulty algorithm, a group of miners will switch to BCH in mass and pump BCH to huge levels. This will cause a panic sell of BTC and cause people to try and transfer BTC from their wallets to exchanges, but because all the miners have left and the difficulty is locked, the network will be clogged with slow and expensive transactions for the next 2 weeks, spelling the end of Bitcoin.

    Longer Story

    I'm going to assume most people here are fairly new to crypto and weren't around for all the politics and drama between /r/bitcoin and /r/btc

    There's a lot to understand about the interplay between difficulty algorithm changes, miner reward incentives, the politics of the pools that take a while to go into.

    These two articles might help catch you up:

    Two weeks ago we saw something similar when BCH exploded and BTC went all the way down to $5500. This was because BTC had a difficulty algorithm change and BCH was approximately 3-4x more profitable to mine. Only Slush kept mining BTC so we'll see if they stay true to BTC this time around too.

    Right now we're seeing BTC, ETH, and most alts fall at the exact same time BCH rises. This might be bots reading the right indicators and buying/selling.

    The estimated time of the difficulty algorithm changes is on the bottom of https://fork.lol/pow/retarget

    Other important items to note:

    • Coinbase still has a bunch of BCH locked up until Jan 1
    • CME futures open up in December, depending on what happens in the next few days it could be more chaos as MSM and retail investors try to wrap their heads around this mess
    • There's always an element of "buy the rumor, sell the news" which we may be seeing right now with the run up from $1200 to $1700. But be aware, this is MASSIVE volume we're seeing for a "buy the rumor" scenario
    • Currently most of this volume is in Korea by a wide margin. Most speculate that this is Chinese playing on Korean exchanges after the ban, the change in volume after September is obvious

    Will Thanksgiving Weekend 2017 be like Thanksgiving Weekend 2013? We'll see...

    Strategies

    • Start moving your BTC and alts off of wallets and into the right exchanges just in case the networks get clogged and you want to be ready to make a move
    • Go into FIAT to avoid this drama and enter in again after this passes
    • Go into BCH
    • Put some super low limit orders on BTC in case stop orders and panic selling cause another flash crash like ETH had on GDAX

    FAQ

    What is the "dragon" being slain?

    Some think it's Bitcoin, the biggest crypto. Other think it's a private chat group that a bunch of Core folks are in that they self-dubbed the Dragon's Den in an self-mocking fashion

    Isn't this just some stupid 4chan meme?

    Rational brains would agree, and chances are it really is and Jihan and gang are shaking their head in disbelief that people would believe something like this.

    But $4B of volume on BCH is undeniable, and not something that a bunch of "trolls" can just conjure up.

    submitted by /u/darkally
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    If Litecoin doesn’t hit $100 by the end of the year then I will drink an entire bottle of ketchup live.

    Posted: 23 Nov 2017 06:19 AM PST

    REQ - A look at the technical Facts. Reviewed by co founder.

    Posted: 23 Nov 2017 04:05 PM PST

    Repost looking at the technical FAQ.

    SOURCE: Speculative Rationality

    Etienne Tatur (Co-founder & CTO at Request Network) and Adm (a developer in the community working closely with REQ community and developers) have reviewed the below FAQs and provided comments.

    How do transactions work on the Request Network? | Are REQ tokens burned as a fee for transactions?

    Transactions can occur directly on the network however in practice most transactions would be done via the Request APIs – Gateways. The gateways enable the layman to interact and transact with the Request network easily without needing to understand what is under the hood. The gateways also allow Request to be currency and chain agnostic and ensures the success of the Request Network roll-out to the non-crypto world.

    To complete each transaction there is a set fee levied by the Request Network from the Gateways in the form of token burn. To ensure that the transactions are always verified a Gateway must have a continuous and replenishing supply of REQ tokens. An increase in transactions on the network concurrent with a decrease in the supply of available tokens will mean an appreciation to the value of each REQ token. Note that the set fee decreases inversely to the tokens value appreciation as the network evolves and is more frequently used, thus always maintaining their competitive low fees.

    How does Request use the token burn mechanism? | How does it benefit a Request token holder?

    The burning mechanism is a very exciting feature of Request Network. Vitalik Buterin, founder of Ethereum, wrote a blog post that highlights the benefits of the burning mechanism – On Medium-of-Exchange Token Valuations. He concludes that for a token to have stable value over time "it is highly beneficial for the token supply to have sinks (sic burn) – places where tokens actually disappear and so the total token quantity decreases over time".

    The Request Network requires the burning of tokens as part of the verification that a transaction has occurred. The burned tokens are removed from the circulating supply altogether. This decreases the overall supply of available Request tokens over time. Concurrently, the demand for tokens will increase over time as the number of transactions on the network increases.

    The increase in demand for tokens to complete transactions at the same time as the decrease in token supply due to "burning" results emphatically in the increase in token value. The increase in value of the tokens will also allow the set fee for transactions to be reduced over time allowing the network to maintain its low-fee competitive edge.

    The more the network is used the more value it produces to its token holders. As a result, holding REQ tokens makes it a lucrative investment if it achieves network effect.

    Can anyone use the Request Network? | Will they need tokens to use the Request Network?

    Short answer: Yes, anyone can use the Request Network and they don't need request tokens to use it. In practice all interactions with the Request Network will happen through the APIs. "Gateways" will then be created using the APIs which will act as a middleman between the sender and receiver. In turn this abstracts the need for either party to hold Request tokens or have any development knowledge. Request Network is Chain and Currency agnostic and is primed for real world (non-crypto) implementation.

    Long Answer: There is a strong focus and vision from the Request networks on making it easier to pay in cryptocurrencies, not only fiat, anywhere. For example B2B, online transactions and even Point of Sale. In line with that we have confirmation that the network is chain agnostic and currency agnostic. This is to say that the Request Network can interact with other chains through the use of oracles, essentially not restricting payments or requests to be only in the form of ETH, expanding further to other chains and fiat as well.

    This allows request network to be currency agnostic, allowing API developers or requestors to make a request outside the Ethereum chain. In essence anyone interacting with the Request network never need hold the REQ token, allowing a far greater audience to partake in the network. This makes it infinitely easier to implement worldwide in a non-crypto environment.

    This does not make the Request token obsolete though, read above explanation on token burn for transactions. See below an example illustrating the use of Gateways to make the Request Network Chain agnostic and Currency Agnostic.

    Diagram

    *Adam is a developer – Adam sets up a Payment Gateway using the API on the Request Network. Adam holds a reserve of Request tokens which are used for the REQ fee for using the network. Adam also overlays a 5% fee on top of the set network fee for the use of his Gateway.

    Supplier, David, uses the payment Gateway to make a Request. The Supplier outlines in which form of currency he wishes for the payment. David has requested that he be paid in Fiat.

    The Request is relayed to the Customer, Sarah. Customer is able to use a number of methods to make payment and in a number of different currencies (fiat or chains like ETH, BTC etc). Sarah decides to make the payment in BTC.

    Once Sarah has made the payment, it goes through the Gateway. This is when the conversions takes place, BTC to Fiat in this example to pay the Supplier David. There are various ways in which the conversion could happen such as the usage of Oracles, a 0x based relayer such as the "The 0cean" could be used and more. * NOTE: All transactions made on other chains (in this example the BTC chain) on behalf of the Request Network are confirmed and verified via the use of Oracles.

    Can you stake on the Request Network?

    Short answer: Not yet. It is all dependent on the development of technology on the Ethereum Network, Plasma and Sharding in particular. Developers are open to staking and this coupled with burning tokens makes Request Network a must hold investment.

    Long answer: The developers' comments are that they are keeping their options open, so essentially, we don't know yet. The developers have set up a burning mechanism to help scale the project. As tokens are burned for every transaction over time the value of the token is increased.

    It should be noted though that the Request Network is open to the concept of staking and would readily implement depending on the new technologies being introduced to the Ethereum network, for further reading look into Plasma and Sharding on the Ethereum Network.

    How this will all play out is still vague until further developments on the Ethereum network are made. There could even be the possibility that Request will fork from the Ethereum network and use staking to secure the network. With the burning mechanism (Gateways) and staking (PoS) working hand in hand Request could cater to both developers who create Gateways and lay investors who want to create a form of passive income for holding tokens.

    How does the reputation system for transactions work? How can you know a requester is trustworthy in a decentralized market?

    The yellow paper by the Request Network outlines a Payer and Payee ID. These IDs are a customer's and supplier's reputation. The network will comprehensively evaluate each ID based on how they interacted, on time payments, late payments, refunds, cancellations and so on. Though there may be no rating system with stars or comments about how a product was damaged or the customer not paying, the recording of all interactions with an ID would be more than sufficient, if not even better than bias reviews.

    What are the other functions of Request Network other than a payment system?

    Assistance in accounting and automating accounting. An example of streamlining payments was also given in the white paper, where paying on the network can calculate the tax and sends directly to the tax office.

    Essentially by utilising the request network companies can leverage the ledger as a form of accounting. Creating their own models from APIs that work with the ledger to automate their accounting process. In theory if all the company's transactions from their customers is from the Request Network it would be an open ledger for public access. This may sound like something a company may never want to do, but imagine if this was the Gold standard for transparency by companies. The blockchain is immutable allowing trust in companies to be easily fostered. In the future the public may demand all companies act accordingly.

    submitted by /u/Lifeandthecosmos
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    This van just pulled up next to me!

    Posted: 23 Nov 2017 07:32 PM PST

    Ledger Nano S on Sale for Black Friday !

    Posted: 23 Nov 2017 06:13 PM PST

    Vertcoin Development Update November 23, 2017

    Posted: 23 Nov 2017 12:26 PM PST

    Privacy Coins Dash, Monero to Unseat Bitcoin? Not Yet but Murmurs Grow

    Posted: 24 Nov 2017 12:55 AM PST

    President of Belarus Expected to Sign Decree to Legalize Cryptocurrencies

    Posted: 24 Nov 2017 02:06 AM PST

    IOTA Foundation hires CYBERCRYPT

    Posted: 23 Nov 2017 11:59 AM PST

    !!! Warning to new LISK investors !!!

    Posted: 24 Nov 2017 03:24 AM PST

    1) On 22 november the lisk team hosted a livestream and showed the world complete incompetence. Delays, excuses, Powerpoint that a 9-year old could make and swearing in front of an audience.

    2) Lisk dpos system is currently run by a group of people who earn $1500 a day for doing nothing. All complaints about this we're removed by lisk team member Lindsay to /liskdelegates to keep this hidden from new investors.

    3) Lisk team member Isabella sold 50.000 lisk right before the meetup. She did this with inside information, knowing the meetup would bring bad news. In the real world you would go to jail for this kind of behaviour.

    4) current market is controled by whales with huge stacks of lisk pumping the market and then dumping again stealing new investors money.

    submitted by /u/MrtNew
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    Bitfinex IOTA/EUR soon!

    Posted: 23 Nov 2017 11:31 AM PST

    Vertcoin passes every single requirement to be listed on GDAX/Coinbase, and they're open about adding new coins in 2018... much bullish.

    Posted: 23 Nov 2017 12:52 PM PST

    Millennials may prefer Bitcoin over savings accounts for storing their wealth

    Posted: 23 Nov 2017 09:47 AM PST

    What is this DASH spam?

    Posted: 23 Nov 2017 11:31 PM PST

    Factom (FCT) News: SECOND Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation Grant and THIRD DHS Grant

    Posted: 23 Nov 2017 08:48 PM PST

    Accept the truth even if you dislike it. This will save you money and make you a better investor.

    Posted: 23 Nov 2017 05:02 PM PST

    If a project is not as good as you first thought, it's better to change your mind sooner than keep lying to yourself until you lose most of your money. However, if you rejected a good project earlier it is better to invest late than to pretend it's no good.

    submitted by /u/backforwardlow
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    My analysis on the merits of ZenCash (ZEN) and why I think it's a great coin to invest in

    Posted: 23 Nov 2017 06:34 PM PST

    A certain publication has shilled the hell out of this coin, and I'm personally sick of it too, but a lot of stuff is coming up for this coin that make it a really good play.

    block rewards

    To start, the reward structure of ZEN is much more refined than its privacy coin siblings. Zcash has 20% of the mining fees going to its core team - that's $10 million/mo at their current valuation. They were the first coin to implement zk-SNARKS, but that reward structure is unsustainable.

    ZEN has a much more measured approach with 12% of the block reward split amongst the core team, community developers, and secure node operators; which brings us to their upcoming release next week.

    secure nodes

    ZEN's highly anticipated secure nodes are going live on the main-net on November 30th, which is also particularly compelling from an investor's perspective: https://i.redd.it/k81wxa6xkkzz.jpg

    In general, cryptocurrency nodes validate miner solutions and ensure the integrity of the blockchain by requiring consensus among different nodes. Secure node operators ensure that all information transmitted to/from their nodes are encrypted.

    Right now, no other privacy coin offers end-to-end encryption; only your activity on the blockchain is masked. This means that governments can still link your network traffic to your identity. ZEN's secure nodes offer a novel solution for end-to-end encryption and is—in my opinion—huge for anyone looking to make private transactions.

    With all the concerns over net-neutrality recently, ISPs/governments are unable to censor access to the ZEN network with secure nodes in place. Through domain fronting, your ZEN transactions can be masked to seem as if you're trying to communicate with an entirely different site.

    miscellaneous

    I'm extremely confident in this project's devs (knowing some of them personally) and their Github activity shows how active development is. What's particularly impressive is that they've written custom libraries to make it easy to build wallets and other user-facing apps (like an anonymous chat client). To me, this shows that they're not just some half-assed fork [of Zcash].

    They also have a rebranding scheduled within the next few weeks, although I can't really comment on that since I'm more interested in the technical merits of the project. But hey, NEO will tell you it works 😛

    This goes without saying, but I obviously hold some ZEN. And maybe you should consider getting some yourself.

    submitted by /u/harambissimo
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    It's Happening. Ethereum Developer Meetup Turnout Today @ the University of Toronto

    Posted: 23 Nov 2017 10:17 PM PST

    Multi-Millionaire Dan Bilzerian is into cryptocurrencies

    Posted: 23 Nov 2017 02:37 PM PST

    Token Sale Update — Gladius

    Posted: 23 Nov 2017 11:07 AM PST

    Bittrex Black Friday!

    Posted: 24 Nov 2017 02:23 AM PST

    I'm out of crypto until the Tether bubble bursts

    Posted: 23 Nov 2017 06:14 PM PST

    After carefully considering the evidence presented in this subreddit and elsewhere on the Bitfinex/Tether price manipulation, I've exited the market entirely. It could get really ugly. Like, Mt. Gox level ugly, the kind of ugly that sets cryptocurrency back months or years.

    I was extremely skeptical about what I viewed as the "Tether Conspiracy Theory" at first, I mean, come on, a major exchange wouldn't dare manipulate the markets, especially not in such an irresponsible manner. Surely, a large corporation would know that they can't get away with fraud involving hundreds of millions of dollars, which could collapse the markets and imperil the investments of millions of innocent people right? Right!?

    Unfortunately, and I genuinely hope I am wrong, but the evidence does seems to suggest otherwise. Let me summarize what I've learned here:

    1. There's a motive, besides simple greed. Bitfinex was hacked this year and was likely insolvent (although this is not proven either way). They solved the problem by issuing equity tokens to affected users, then had to buy back those tokens before lawsuits caught up to them for an abvious breach of their Terms of Service (see https://medium.com/@bitfinexed/the-bitfinex-dilemma-blow-up-now-or-try-a-hail-mary-to-retain-in-business-10b9d989359f)

    2. Tether/Bitfinex claims to back every USDT with a USD. If that were the case, it'd be really easy to prove, and it'd show everyone that there is no fraud taking place. But despite public pressure, they haven't shown any proof! No independent public audit, nothing of substance at all. The natural conclusion has to be that every USDT is not backed with a USD. In that case, where are the Tethers coming from? What are they used for? What is stopping Bitfinex from printing Tethers and just buying Bitcoin? And if Tethers were backed by USD, why aren't they guaranteed to be redeemable 1:1 for USD?

    3. Bitfinex have manipulated their own markets before, causing flash crashes. Yep, it's hard to believe, but it's true. Check this out: https://medium.com/@bitfinexed/fake-it-till-you-make-it-when-bitfinex-themselves-used-to-spoof-their-entire-orderbook-18294585338 Bitfinex'ed on Medium has done a good job at documenting many of the concerns with Bitfinex, I'd recommend checking out more of those articles if you're interested. I don't know what this person's motives are but the articles are factual, as far as I can tell.

    4. Bitfinex doesn't have a bank. The banks won't go near them. That's a a major red flag in my mind.

    5. The Tether hack. I don't fully understand what impact this will have, but the timing is suspicious, isn't it? https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/21/technology/bitcoin-bitfinex-tether.html

    I also read these threads: https://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/6n1ycr/tether_scares_the_hell_out_of_me/ https://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/7e2seb/bitfinextether_must_prove_solvency_refuse/ https://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/7epmj5/we_need_to_stop_using_bitfinex_and_tether/ https://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/7d2fzd/despite_no_banking_bitfinex_continues_to_issue/

    This person (20 day old redditor) tries to refute the claims. https://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/6yqeqv/the_truth_about_bitfinex_and_tether/

    They have some points, but I am not convinced. And again, I wonder about their motives, especially when they say stuff like "how much can $395M in Tether really affect the price of Bitcoin?" No one knows the answer, but I suspect that it can have a large effect on the price (hundreds or thousands of $/BTC) especially since propping up the market encourages new investors to enter.

    Once again, I hope I'm wrong, but the situation looks bad. I am extremely bullish on cryptocurrency long term... I hope we can get past this without too much blood on the streets, but I'll be ready to buy when the heads start rolling...

    submitted by /u/Sesquipedalism
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