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    BTC IvanOnTech admits Lightning Network will need to become centralized

    February 23, 2019

    BTC IvanOnTech admits Lightning Network will need to become centralized

    IvanOnTech admits Lightning Network will need to become centralized

    Posted: 22 Feb 2019 08:05 PM PST

    "Which basically means it is kind of centralized, but it has to be this way if we want mass adoption"

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ARx8UVfvG2o&feature=youtu.be&t=806

    submitted by /u/playfulexistence
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    when you become a crypto trader...

    Posted: 23 Feb 2019 12:04 AM PST

    An Ode To You, Bitcoin Cash Supporters, Heroically Growing The Peer To Peer Cash For The World Movement. Huge Massive Respects!

    Posted: 22 Feb 2019 11:42 PM PST

    Irony:"Ave person won't be running LN routing node" But CORE/BTC said big-blocks bad since everyone can't run their own node

    Posted: 22 Feb 2019 09:31 AM PST

    TIL: one of the biggest fudders about BCH (Sunny Decree) used to be a huge Bitconnect scammer

    Posted: 22 Feb 2019 05:27 PM PST

    Man With Common Sense Reacts To Lightning Fanboy Dev

    Posted: 22 Feb 2019 06:25 PM PST

    Open Question to the community: What is the purpose of the fight against Core? What are you trying to accomplish by making all these counter topics against LN?

    Posted: 22 Feb 2019 08:33 PM PST

    LN routing isn't just unsolved, it is unsolvable.

    Posted: 22 Feb 2019 11:50 AM PST

    In LN each channel is a multisignature address with some funds on them. A payment on LN is executed by one of the parties to this address signing a transaction sending the funds of the address to the refund addresses of each channel participant. By setting the amount of the funds, it expresses a balance (how much of the channel belongs to whom). Channel balances are intentionally private, the messages for updating these balances (the signed but not broadcast transactions) are only seen by each partner of a channel. If the message is countersigned and broadcast, it closes the LN channel.

    All channels are therefore registered on the blockchain, the topology of the network is known. However, the channel balances are not known.

    Routing a payment along a path (and not just between two parties) is accomplished with a bit of clever cryptography that ensures nobody can steal from anybody. However, if the chosen path has not enough capacity to satisfy the payment, the payment has failed. is stuck, for several hours until it times out. (apparently LN solves stuck payments on capacity, somehow).

    The sender of a payment has to select a path. This has to be done based on insufficient information (just the topology of the network). But a crucial part, the channel balances, are unknown. So no path along which a payment is attempted, can be guaranteed to work.

    As the LN network grows (let's assume in some fashion of a decentralized network), paths grow longer. The longer the paths get, the higher the chances that one of any of the channels along the path has insufficient balance to satisfy the payment.

    It is impossible to create any sort of routing and keep channel balances private at the same time. In order to arrive at a feasible route, channel balances have to be discoverable. But in order for privacy (as promised by LN) to be possible, channel balances have to remain private.

    submitted by /u/pyalot
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    Electron Cash 3.3.6 available for Windows, Mac & Linux

    Posted: 22 Feb 2019 01:22 PM PST

    3.3.6 Changes:

    • Support for op_return_raw= URI parameter to 'bitcoincash:' URIs. This paremeter is for raw hex to be used as the OP_RETURN payload (0x6a will always be prefixed to this raw hex.) (markblundeberg)
    • Testnet wallets were using the wrong bip32 key headers. They SHOULD accept & generate tpub/tprv on testnet but instead the keys generated were xpub/xprv. This was not to spec and has been fixed but, it may mean you will need to regenerate your testnet wallets form mnemonic seed. :/ (cculianu)
    • Added "Check for updates..." mechanism which is enabled by default (check is done once per hour). See Preferences -> General to disable auto check. Or Help -> "Check for updates..." for manual checking. (cculianu)
    • Added "Dark" theme to UI. See Preferences -> General (cculianu)
    • Fixed incompatibility bug where generated QR images were uppercase-only BITCOINCASH: which caused problems with some buggy wallet implementations. We switched back to generating 'bitcoincash:' (mixed-case) URIs, which is more compatible. (cculianu)
    • Added "Export contacts" facility to UI so you can export all your contacts to a file. (Strangely, we had "Import contacts", but no export!) (cculianu)
    • Added "Wallet -> Rebuild history" to Qt GUI. Allows users to re-synch entire wallet from server, on demand. (commit: a72b2a72, cculianu)
    • Request fee estimate from ElectrumX/ElectronX server every 20 minutes (cculianu)
    • Performance improvements for wallets with huge numbers of tx's (cculianu)
    • Trezor bugfix (SomberNight)
    • Append HMAC to Bitbox messages (TheCharlatan)
    • Android fixes (mhsmith)
    • Various internal bugfixes and code refactoring (cculianu, ecdsa, SomberNight)
    • servers.json updated (torusJKL)
    • Fixed a compatibility issue with Qt 5.12 (SomberNight, cculianu)

    Only download from: https://electroncash.org

    GitHub Repository: https://www.github.com/Electron-Cash/Electron-Cash

    (iOS and Android versions will be out soon).

    submitted by /u/NilacTheGrim
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    Elon Musk: 'Paper money is going away' - CNBC

    Posted: 23 Feb 2019 02:38 AM PST

    Anyone in the Rogue Valley interested in doing a Crypto Meetup?

    Posted: 22 Feb 2019 09:09 PM PST

    A few coworkers/friends and I are wanting to do a cryptocurrency meetup in the Rogue Valley. I'd like to see if there's any Bitcoin Cash people interested in attending if we were to do one, or if anyone would like to help organize. Send me a PM if interested!

    submitted by /u/UTXONinja
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    In 2017 he sold all their belongings, moved his family into a trailer, and invested in all in Bitcoin! So, where are they now?

    Posted: 22 Feb 2019 09:26 PM PST

    BTC is a dinosaur that needs to die

    Posted: 22 Feb 2019 05:09 PM PST

    Sent $8 USD , yeah 8 fucking dollars worth of Bitcoin to an external wallet today and the fee was $2 dollars.

    I then sent $8 dollars of bchabc to an external wallet and.....I recieved $8 dollars worth!

    The fees for Bitcoin are fucking ridiculous, yeah some currency of the future, good luck with that.

    submitted by /u/FomoAthBro
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    What does "Automatic Replay Protection" mean?

    Posted: 23 Feb 2019 01:35 AM PST

    "Automatic Replay Protection

    When the median time past [2] of the most recent 11 blocks (MTP-11) is less than UNIX timestamp 1573819200 (Nov 2019 upgrade) Bitcoin Cash full nodes MUST enforce the following rule:

    forkid [1] to be equal to 0. When the median time past [1] of the most recent 11 blocks (MTP-11) is greater than or equal to UNIX timestamp 1573819200 (Nov 2019 upgrade) Bitcoin Cash full nodes implementing the May 2019 consensus rules SHOULD enforce the following change:

    Update forkid [1] to be equal to 0xFF0002. ForkIDs beginning with 0xFF will be reserved for future protocol upgrades. This particular consensus rule MUST NOT be implemented by Bitcoin Cash wallet software. Wallets that follow the upgrade should not have to change anything."

    https://github.com/bitcoincashorg/bitcoincash.org/blob/master/spec/2019-05-15-upgrade.md

    submitted by /u/utrd
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    Showerthought: OF COURSE the head of twitter would promote something establishment friendly (LN). Can you really imagine him promoting peer to peer electronic cash?

    Posted: 22 Feb 2019 08:22 AM PST

    World aint ready for dis shit. Discuss.

    submitted by /u/jonald_fyookball
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    Just released: BitAuth IDE — open source language, compiler, and IDE for creating custom Bitcoin Cash wallets

    Posted: 22 Feb 2019 09:56 AM PST

    Post For AntMiner Owners

    Posted: 22 Feb 2019 10:33 PM PST

    Selling AntMiner Monitoring System - MITHRA 5.6

    ​

    Functions:

    There Are Some Of The Functions Which Can Be Executed By MITHRA

    1. AntMiner Reboot Via One Click

    2. Miner Groups System

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    5. Error, High Temperature Detect

    6. AutoMail System When Error/Warning Detected

    7. AJAX Refresh System (Without Whole Page Reload)

    8. Authorization System

    And Still Working On Some New Functions (Like Auto Reboot Function When AntMiner Hashrate Is Lower Than X)

    Latest Version Is Mithra 5.6 (With More Comfortable Theme Than Old Versions)

    SUPPORTED ANTMINERS: S9(S9j), L3+, L3, A3, Z9-Mini, T9(T9+), DR3, D3, S7

    submitted by /u/davit13882
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    LN will end up as a network of tier 1 providers who own 90%+ of the liquidity

    Posted: 22 Feb 2019 08:03 AM PST

    TL;DR: Lightning network isn't ready to scale up to route millions of nodes. Only way it can work is if all the liquidity is concentrated in a few tier 1 providers. Most of the transactions made will be within the subnet of the same provider (2 hops at max) which means source and destination is transparent to the tier 1 nodes.

    ​

    Hi all, I'm generally a bystander in this subreddit as I don't necessarily share the bitcoin (BCH) maximalist philosophy that seems to be prevalent here. But I do like to browse from time to time in order to keep up to date with the technical progress being made by the devs working on BCH and trying to understand how everything works from a technical perspective.

    ​

    Recently I have been looking at the work that's being done on LN and how there has been a sudden shift in marketing it not as a beta network that has unsolved issues like routing (which was the case for a long time) to a ready for use product using tactics such as the participation in LN Chain by Jack Dorsey and other mainstream figures. As an engineer it's clear to me that LN can't scale while keeping the distribution decentralized and I will try to explain the technical side of it a bit later. However seeing the recent marketing push and shift in narrative I think now the goal of decentralization has been thrown away by BTC devs and supporters which should be a bit concerning for all of us.

    The technical issue of routing:

    Routing in a decentralized peer to peer network is a well known computer science problem. Finding a route from any point A to point B is trivial if all the nodes and their connections are known in advance and if these connections and nodes stay static and unchanging. If those two conditions aren't met then the only way to find a route between two points is to use a variation of Dijkstra's algorithm. Problem here is that this algorithm depends on creating a 2 dimensional array (a.k.a table) of size NxN where N is the number of nodes in the network. This table has to be stored either in RAM or if using "out of core access" algorithms on the harddisk (though this second approach is quite slow). This entails that the node that is meant to calculate the route must know the updated state of all connections across the network and have them stored in memory for quick access. Anytime a change to this topology is made this map needs to be updated on each node. So far so good.

    ​

    Limitations:

    The problem comes when you try to scale the network past a certain point. For example if we assume that there are a million nodes on the LN network and that their connections are represented by a 256 bit integer (to represent balance between the channel) then the space requirements for the network will be 1000000 x 1000000 x 256 bits which equates to 29.1 Terabytes which have to be stored in RAM for quick access or in the harddisk for fast access. As explained before this space requirement is because the only algorithm that was discovered, in 30 years of routing related research by the giant companies running the internet who have invested billions of dollars finding alternatives, works by storing a table in memory and therefore has N^2 space requirements. Since LN works on the principle of route calculation by the originating user it means that each user has to run such a hefty system in order to participate. At most this can be reduced by half because you can store a single signed integer for a connection instead of two unsigned one. Looking at how low LN transaction fees are it's simply unfeasible to run such an operation though I assume this point can be remedied by simply increasing the transaction fees when enough people have onboarded. Now remember that the goal of BTC supporters was to create a network in which even a raspberry pi could participate. If nearly all the transactions are happening on LN which has such hefty requirements then I'm sure you can see that a raspberry pi won't be able to host a node at all. So this cuts down the number of people who are able to run a node to a very small amount. Which means that not only will most of the liquidity be owned by a few nodes due to how the pareto distribution works but also that nodes will have little choice other than to connect to these Tier 1 nodes. And since it's nearly impossible for a normal user to participate in LN the network will end up looking like a server-client system where any two users can be connected via maximum 3 hops (orign user -> Tier 1a -> Tier 1b -> end user). Since the Tier 1s are going to be run by known corporations it's not daft to conclude that they can figure out who is sending money to where despite the TOR like packaged encryption of transactions simply because all normal users are at most 1 hop away from a Tier 1 node.

    ​

    For a long time I had thought that the devs were hoping that they would be able to figure out the holy grail of networking and solve the routing problem but given the recent push I think they might not want to solve it. And that vision of LN being marketed to everyone is just a lure to get everyone onboard banking 2.0.
    If you have any technical rebuttals etc feel free to comment. I would love to be proven wrong here.

    submitted by /u/moazzam2k
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    Contractors Adopting Bitcoin BCH - Loop Closing In North Queensland

    Posted: 22 Feb 2019 04:36 AM PST

    Bitcoin building bullish momentum above $3900

    Posted: 22 Feb 2019 09:07 PM PST

    Big pool CashShuffle test this weekend. Anyone that wants to try out shuffling their coins with electron-cash, now is the time! Got download your compatible client and get shuffling! https://cashshuffle.com/

    Posted: 23 Feb 2019 02:48 AM PST

    Thoughts on Antminer S15 - 28TH Bitcoin Miner

    Posted: 22 Feb 2019 03:54 PM PST

    What are your thoughts on the S15? I know ROI is basically forever at this point, but do you think that if we enter a bull market any time soon that it will be profitable? I'm looking at mining more as an expensive hobby than an investment, but I also hope to get close to breaking even eventually.

    submitted by /u/CryptoMatttt
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    All these threads slagging off Lightning are missing the point

    Posted: 22 Feb 2019 02:07 PM PST

    Lightning could be great, BTC's problem is not LN but the 1mb block limit that will never be allowed to change. They have conflated immutability with resistance to protocol upgrades. It doesn't matter how good L2 is if L1 cannot scale.

    submitted by /u/Leithm
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    Shout out to @RichardBranson who is helping raise funds for Venezuelan's. We are also trying to aid the people of Venezuela through the use of Bitcoin as cash to help them escape economic crisis & give them better means to transfer and use money. #VenezuelaAid #VenezuelaAidLive

    Posted: 22 Feb 2019 07:25 AM PST
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