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    Bitcoin Daily Discussion, January 26, 2018

    January 26, 2018

    Bitcoin Daily Discussion, January 26, 2018

    Daily Discussion, January 26, 2018

    Posted: 26 Jan 2018 02:00 AM PST

    Please utilize this sticky thread for all general Bitcoin discussions! If you see posts on the front page or /r/Bitcoin/new which are better suited for this daily discussion thread, please help out by directing the OP to this thread instead. Thank you!

    Daily threads are fast paced! If you don't get an answer to your question, you can try phrasing it differently or commenting again tomorrow.

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    Your price screenshots and repetitive submissions are being removed, so please stop submitting them!

    Please check the previous discussion thread for unanswered questions.

    submitted by /u/rBitcoinMod
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    Keeping Coinbase on their toes - Robinhood adds no-fee crypto trading!

    Posted: 25 Jan 2018 08:19 AM PST

    CME BTC Futures Expiring (anti-FUD)

    Posted: 26 Jan 2018 12:43 AM PST

    This is the first batch of futures expiring 4 PM London time (upvote to stop FUD). RELAX, short positions will unload BTC that they used in the spot market as a hedge.. Buy the dip if you're lucky and we get one. Stop panicking.

    submitted by /u/e295749
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    Doug Polk on Roger Ver

    Posted: 25 Jan 2018 11:03 PM PST

    304,876 people in line for early access to Robinhood Crypto Trading (coming FEB) and GROWING!

    Posted: 25 Jan 2018 08:16 PM PST

    Robinhood Crypto: Just hit 200k requests for early access.

    Posted: 25 Jan 2018 01:18 PM PST

    Venezuela - A Prime Example of Bitcoin Usefulness.

    Posted: 25 Jan 2018 03:56 PM PST

    As of my writing 5USD is equal to 1,319,015 VEF Venezuelan Bolivar...

    2 Months ago, 5 USD was worth 545, 450 VEF..

    Like in the USA, people used to buy groceries monthly or bi monthly. Now they are living day to day, buying enough food to be able to eat for that day, as they cannot afford to buy groceries for longer than that. On top of that, regulations on their food prevent them buying enough to last over a week, much less a month. The "basic goods basket", which is the amount of money required to buy basic goods for a month is priced at about 8-10 times more than one can make in a month.. So with minimum wage you are able to buy 6-10 meals in a month without waging in electricity, water, garbage disposal, cable, telephone, internet, school, clothing, etc.

    People spend their days thinking what line are they going to be in tomorrow. You often hear "I have to go to [store] tomorrow, they are going to sell [item]." Every day, that's all that's in their minds. It used to be driving to the market, but now you cannot even drive to the stores needed to buy these items. Cars are defunct and cannot be repaired, as nobody has the money. Due to the regulations, a new group of people have come in and made money off the rest of the people. They find the goods at regulation maximum, and buy all the goods. Then they resell to the rest of Venezuelans at waay more expensive prices than needed. That makes the regulation prices (minimum wage for a month gives a week of food), into alot more expensive prices, and families have to ration to eating about one or twice a week maximum.

    I was born in Venezuela, and as an 17 year old, through a quite harrowing experience, I was smuggled out with my mother and we built a small life for ourselves in the USA. My father, along with my other relatives and siblings stayed as they didnt want to leave the others but wanted me and mother to try surviving a better life.

    Despite the fact I am out of Venezuela, majority of my family lives there and I had a hard time with that. I couldnt send money to them, nor could I send goods because the Venezuelan postmen are notorious for looking through packages sent and pocketing what they think is valuable. Then I was introduced to Bitcoin. Bitcoin was anonymous. The Venezuelan government couldnt intercept that mail, as it was a digital mail. I saved up and visited my family in Venezuela in October 2017 and set them up to receive bitcoin from me and taught them how to sell it. Whenever they could, they used some BTC i gave them and sold just enough through localbitcoins and bought plenty of goods as they could. 15 USD worth of BTC gave them enough to fund food and other goods for a month. (They are a family of 8). They sold just enough as they needed in a month as inflation made that money lose half of its value in a few weeks. Through the use of Bitcoin, I was able to send money to my family and they could actually USE it.

    I, now 25 and still living with my mother, have a job that allows me to have a little extra than I need, even though not much. So whatever extra money I have expendable every 2 weeks after my paycheck goes to buy more btc. I am able to send enough and make enough money money out of altcoins to make my family and 6 other families survive and not completely starve themselves every month. (about 100-300USD) My family, the good but frustrating people they are, still dont use most of the money for themselves and give out money to others for them to survive too.

    My whole point of this account is that you can hate bitcoin and cryptocurrencies all you want. You can call it a bubble or call me stupid for investing in to it. But the use of bitcoin and its "decentralized" nature allows my family and a few others to get VEF and survive, when they were scraping on the side and starving themselves. They can circumvent the governmental control and have a small living. And despite their situation, I thank Bitcoin, whomever developed it, and all its users for me being able to do this and pay forward my luck to other members in humanity.

    Thanks for reading..

    • EDIT; This was not and is not intent of writing this post, as I was planning on doing this myself, but a few PMs and comments inspired me to do this. I have placed a newly created bitcoin address. It is created with the intent of taking the btc and placing it Venezuela. I will not trade or do anything with it and will share pictures of what the effect of everything that is possible with your bitcoin donations (from food to education). Remember, even 5 dollars is more than a monthly salary for many of these people, so any little amount helps. If you want me to add a new address for another cryptocurrency, feel free to message me what you would like to donate. Not necessary nor urged, im already doing it with my own money, but if you feel like you want to contribute, even if i am a stranger on the internet, feel free to do so.

    1GLoEUV1QBuuyJHseaKCXiQDsvH5Jpehqi

    submitted by /u/ZeConfusedOneAgain
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    The Russian Ministry of Finance has legalized the trade in cryptocurrencies, the central bank disagrees

    Posted: 25 Jan 2018 11:21 PM PST

    People who sell in believe of futures crashing the market are crashing the market.

    Posted: 26 Jan 2018 12:54 AM PST

    Nuff said. Good job.

    submitted by /u/B3nGG
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    ACINQ: Introducing Strike, a stripe-like API for Lightning

    Posted: 25 Jan 2018 10:37 AM PST

    ⚡️⚡️MAINNET LIGHTNING NETWORK HAS REACHED 200 NODES.

    Posted: 25 Jan 2018 02:28 AM PST

    The Bitcoin Lightning Network has a problem: people are already using it

    Posted: 25 Jan 2018 09:21 PM PST

    Square's "Cash" app now supports buying/selling and sending bitcoin

    Posted: 25 Jan 2018 07:25 AM PST

    Expiring Futures Tomorrow... NOT SO FAST!

    Posted: 25 Jan 2018 10:56 AM PST

    The CME futures expire tomorrow, and everyone is panicking that Wall Street will manipulate the price downward to gain the most profit... But it's not that simple; CME has limits on what any given entity can hold, that make it almost unprofitable given the cost of manipulation.

    Any entity is limited to owning 1k contracts containing 5btc each. Every $5 move in bitcoin is a $25 profit/loss on a contract. In the recent month, we saw the price move from $19k to $10k potentially tomorrow at expiration - accounting for a $9k price move, meaning $45M possible profit (per entity holding the maximum 1k contracts; every $1k move in btc price equals a $5M profit/loss). I am a realist, and do believe that multiple entities could collect and agree on a direction (for example 10 groups) meaning the profit would be $450M for the month of January. However, open interest today says this isn't happening (more on that below).

    To manipulate the price today, it costs about $15M to buy all the btc within $1k of the current price (based on the depth chart in GDAX). The group of 10 entities (referenced above) could agree to spend $15M to move the price lower by $1k, thus gaining the group of 10 a total of $50M (or a $35M profit for the group by spending $15M). This will not hold the price down the $1k, however, and many traders would instantly gobble up the orders at the lower price, meaning the entities would need to do this multiple times to keep the price low. A realistic strategy for Wall Street is going to be to hold their "manipulation money" until right before the market closes, and push price down in the hours leading up to expiration (4pm London time, or 11am Eastern Time for CME futures).

    As the market matures and becomes more balanced, these opportunities will be harder to accomplish, but I don't think it's unreasonable that this could happen tomorrow, but likely in the 9am-11am hours, and likely immediately rebound back.

    Finally, the open interest on the futures expiring tomorrow is currently at 1,459 contracts, meaning the total bitcoin in play here is 7,295 btc or ~$80M, meaning the cost of manipulation will dramatically cut into profits. This also means there is not a group of 10 entities teaming up to manipulate the price.

    Just food for thought as people prepare for the Wall Street futures dip tomorrow...

    TLDR; I don't think it'll happen, the business case and open interest just isn't there.

    submitted by /u/jonesjr2010
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    The most annoying thing about this recent correction

    Posted: 25 Jan 2018 12:29 PM PST

    Fucking people giving me the whole I told you so thing.... excuse the rant:

    I made the mistake of telling a close friend of mine that I got in bitcoin early and now the whole office knows and all these little shits are like... you have bitcoin?!? "Awe man, I'm sorry, tough break". Or "dude you have to sell it all right now that bubble has busted".

    For the record, I sold enough to make some off of my initial investment, I'm beyond fine... it's just annoying how now everyone's a expert now when they had no idea what the fuck a bitcoin was 6 months ago.

    Thanks for reading my rant, is anyone else going through this?

    submitted by /u/Ignasty64
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    Robinhood Will Have Zero-Fees for Cryptocurrency Trading

    Posted: 26 Jan 2018 01:22 AM PST

    Coincheck suspended all withdrawal in fiat and cryptocurrencies

    Posted: 26 Jan 2018 12:13 AM PST

    Deanonymization Risks on Lightning Network

    Posted: 25 Jan 2018 07:04 PM PST

    A few days ago I posted about how the differences betweenTor and Lightning Network topologies might undermine the privacy that users are able to achieve with the Lightning implemenation of onion routing. Despite many disparaging remarks about my intentions, both Adam Back (u/adam3us) and Rusty Russell (u/rustyreddit) have replied and indicated that there is at least some validity to the concerns raised. Additional discussion of this topic in various comment threads has inevitably led to questions about what is at risk and what users can to do minimize those risks. I've had time to formulate the beginnings of a response to the former, which is a necessary precursor to eventually answering the latter. It may not be very satisfying to get the answers in this order, but it is the natural result of posting this work as it evolves. So let's get right down to it and explore some of the risk areas I've been able to identify for Lightning Network operators.

    Lightning Network results in many opportunities for an analyst to correlate data across several domains and tie them back to a single pseudonym. Let's call this single identity the operator's nym. For purposes of this post, the nym represents the complete anonymous persona of its associated operator - every Lightning operator has only one nym. An analyst may end up identifying multiple sub-nyms until they're able to link them to a single operator.

    The primary sub-nym on Lightning Network is the node. Nodes have many properties which can uniquely identify them over time and space. This is necessary to ensure you're transacting with whom you intend, even if you don't know their real identity. Long-term node identities are also a requirement for payment channels. Because these properties cover different domains but all link back to the same node identity, deanonymization in one domain affects activity across all domains that can be associated with the node. These properties can also be leveraged by an analyst to associate sub-nyms with their operator's nym.

    So what makes up a node identity?

    • Node ID
    • IP addresses
    • Node customizations
    • Channels
    • On-chain transactions
    • Lightning Transactions

    Node ID. The most obvious identifier for a node is its node_id, the public key the node uses when signing messages on the network. A node's node_id is known by all of its peers. It is not necessary for a transaction sender to expose their node_id, however, the sender must know the receiver's. A node desiring to service third-party transactions must broadcast channel_announcement messages for the channels which can be used for routing, which exposes the node_id to the whole network.

    IP addresses. While the node_id is certainly the strongest node identifier, it is not the only property that could identify a node or link multiple nodes to a nym. Lightning transactions are active, requiring bi-directional communication to complete. To communicate with peers on the internet, nodes require an IP address. At a minimum, this IP address is known to a node's peers and, if the operator wants to invite other nodes to open channels, it may be broadcast to the network in node_announcement messages. Although IP addresses do not prove who is behind them, they can provide a lot of information about the operator's identity and link multiple nodes to a single nym. Connecting to Lightning over anonymizing solutions such as VPNs and Tor can assist in disassociating the IP addresses from the operator, but also introduce new correlation data for observers of those domains.

    Node customizations. The node_announcement messages carry some customizable fields (alias, rgb_color, features) which are not unique, but could still serve to fingerprint nodes if an operator regularly uses a unique or identifiable combination.

    Channels. Nodes can be uniquely identified by their set of channels. Channels which are open at the same time are obvious correlation points; less obvious is the fact that channel relationships are transitive. For instance, if a node initially opens chA and chB, an analyst can easily identified them as belonging to the same node. chA isn't very reliable so the operator closes that channel and some time later opens chC. The analyst, who has been observing the network, can now associate chC with chA through their shared concurrent channel, chB. If the operator then closes chB and later opens chD, the analyst can link all four channels to the single node thanks to this transitive nature, even though chA and chD were never open at the same time nor share any concurrent channels.

    On-chain transactions. Each channel a node participates in will have several addresses which may associate back to the operator's nym. Inputs to the funding transaction and outputs from the commitment transaction are implicitly transitive; there can be some doubt as to the ownership of an output, but there is a known relationship. An analyst monitoring the blockchain activities of a node may be able to use the inputs and outputs to reliably associate channels opened using the proceeds from previously closed channels, even when the channels are associated with different nodes. This is another way in which an analyst might link multiple sub-nyms to a single nym.

    Lightning Transactions. A major trade-off that operators make by transacting over Lightning Network instead of on-chain is that of transaction privacy. In exchange for the promise of keeping their transactions off of the blockchain, Lightning imposes higher risk of transaction correlation. If the privacy guarantees that Lightning provides are breached, deanonymizing the sending and receiving nodes, all exposed transactions can be used by an analyst in an attempt to correlate them to a single nym or operator.

    submitted by /u/tripledogdareya
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    A flood of millennials is entering the space because of the Robinhood App announcement. This is a huge step for Bitcoin into becoming mainstream.

    Posted: 25 Jan 2018 12:16 PM PST

    Brisbane Airport in Australia will soon become the first cryptocurrency terminal, according to local media reports. The airport cooperates with local and international companies to make the entire airport friendly to customers with cryptocurrencies, along with shops, cafes accepting Bitcoin.

    Posted: 26 Jan 2018 02:21 AM PST

    What is a measly 40% correction? The norm.

    Posted: 25 Jan 2018 09:38 PM PST

    Try Lightning Network in 10 seconds⚡️

    Posted: 25 Jan 2018 01:04 PM PST

    Satoshi's original idea for scaling bitcoin: "High Frequency Trading", or primitive payment channels. The Lightning Network was part of Satoshi's Vision® from the beginning.

    Posted: 25 Jan 2018 11:30 AM PST

    https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/2013-April/002417.html

    I just thought it would be interesting for new bitcoiners to learn that the premise of the Lighting Network (updatable, multi-directional payment channels) was originally designed by Satoshi as a smart contract using nLockTime.

    Lightning is more secure than what Satoshi described here, but it relies on some of the very same concepts.

    So those who preach Satoshi's Vision® should realize that Lightning was part of his plan from the beginning.

    submitted by /u/gizram84
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    I just successfully just bought Bitcoin via the Square Cash App

    Posted: 25 Jan 2018 06:33 PM PST

    My friend in 2011 Mined 5.5 BTC. He is sure of it. He cannot remember what Pool he mined on! Need help! Need a list of popular mining pools in 2011.

    Posted: 25 Jan 2018 11:31 PM PST

    My friend in 2011 Mined 5.5 BTC. He is sure of it. He cannot remember what Pool he mined on! Need help! Need a list of popular mining pools in 2011. He knows the email he used to register, so he has been trying to do the Forgot Password on some mining pools, with no luck, I think a good list of popular mining pools in 2011 might help him figure out which one it is!

    submitted by /u/leagueman14
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    U.S. Dollar hits new low

    Posted: 25 Jan 2018 11:51 AM PST
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